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After the success of the first bike build, back in winter, I've now done my second. Again it's in response to the new environment, though this time a bit more fun.
Since November, I've massively improved the garage/workshop. I've got pegboard up with tools, all the bikes are wall-racked, and I've got a proper workbench fitted in, which allows a lot more scope for building stuff up. The winter bike has been swapped over to a hydraulic braking setup, using a set of kit from China by a company called L-Twoo. This was a good trial run for the new bike, getting me used to both the non-standard groupset (and associated software, as its obviously still electronic shifting), and also how to fill and bleed hydrualic brakes.
The New Bike
A Gravel Bike...something that can handle various terrain types, but also tap out mileage on tarmac. My goals were;
- Big tyres...as wide as possible. My road bikes are on 25 or 28mm tyres. I wanted 50mm+
- As light as possible. It will never be as light as a road bike (the tyres alone will mean it's not possible to make it featherlight), but sub-10kg
- Adaptable. At a future date I may want to strap racks to it and go bikepacking
- Cheap. The plan was to use chinese manufacturers directly for the majority of items. No strictly defined budget, but the benchmark was a Canyon Grizl, which is a well-regarded all-round adventure/gravel bike.
- Maintainable. By this I mean no pressfit bottom brackets, and maintainable cabling (not running through headset bearings etc)
I spent a fair bit of time researching various manufacturers, components, and best bang-for-buck. On 1st June I did the main, big order from AliExpress.
- Frame - CWind GT30 (Medium frame size) - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005678330464.html
- Groupset - L-Twoo eGR 1x - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006685470104.html
- Cassette - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001278998057.html
- Cranks - Racework N1 170mm/42T - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006794337930.html
- Bottom Bracket - ZTTO T47/DUB - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003026926242.html
- Wheels - Elite ENT 2.0 38mm Gravel Disc - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006902683405.html
- Handlebars - Toseek RS-wrc 40mm Gravel Bars - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005581865994.html
- Stem - Toseek 110mm / 117' Carbon/Alloy - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004583976536.html
- Seatpost - Toseek 27.2 Carbon - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005286211545.html
- Saddle - RYET 3D Print - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006249187930.html
- Brake Calipers - ZRACE XG Flatmount - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006075139744.html
I then sourced some other stuff either from the supplies in the workshop/garage, or from UK sellers
- Bar Tape for handlebars
- Shimano Deore 12-speed chain + quicklink
- Shimano Deore M540 SPD pedals
- Continental Race King 29 x 2.0 MTB tyres
- Silca Sealant
- Schwalbe Tubeless rim tape
- Tubeless valves
- Internal cable damping
- 160mm disc rotors and centre-lock adaptors
- 2 x 14500 3.7V 800mAh cells
- Garmin mount
- Elite bottle cages
...so what does all this get me?
Well, things of note. Those are mountain bike tyres...wide, chunky (and anoyingly measured in imperial. Metric equivalent is 700c x 50mm). The frame was selected to accept such wide tyres. The wheels will be set up tubeless...no inner tube. Instead the tyre is fitted directly to the wheel rim, and inside some latex sealant is placed. This sloshes around, and fills any small gaps, drying on contact to air. In theory, any small nicks and holes will be filled. The main benefit of this is that the tyres can be run at low pressure (as there is no inner tube to pinch if you hit a rock or a curb), allowing more grip.
I have a 1x12 gear setup. No front deraillier, and at the back i have a very large cassette (from 11 to 46 teeth). The rear derailler is designed to handle a very large range, and also has a tension clutch to keep the chain tighter. I've also got hydraulic brakes, on a nice, sensible 160mm rotor (which I have on all my bikes, so in theory I can swap wheels very quckly in an emergency). I've got electronic shifting, which is really helpful with such a large range on the rear, that rear derailler is doing a lot of moving. Electronic shifting and hydraulic brakes are really nice quality-of-life improvements on a bike. Neither are strictly required, but they make the entire riding process much easier.
The handlebars have a big flare on them...the tops/hoods are 40cm wide, the drops are 56cm wide. This allows a nice narrow position on the hoods on smooth road, and a lower, wider position on uneven ground, giving more stability. The actual sizing was done with reference to my road bike, wth a bit more height on the front, as aerodynamics is a little less important off-road.
Most of the structure of the bike is carbon, keeping the weight down, and also keeping it fairly stiff. I've gone really hard on the yellow/black colourway. This was partly so that I can refer to my bikes by colour (I already have red, white, green and blue).
Assembly
Actually, this all went really well, with a couple of tricky points;
1) The battery for the rear deraillier is in the seat-post, and a wire runs down the seat tube into the chain-stay, then out the back. The internal routing in the chainstay was incredibly tight. I ended up having to grease the wire and connector, and fairly violently yanking it through attached to a metal cable.
2) The brake calipers that came with the groupset were a little ropey, and refused to bleed. I think that the screws that close the bleed ports were not sealing correctly. I ended up swapping over to some ZRACE alternatives, which filled and bled first time.
3) Everything arrived really quickly (within 2 weeks) apart from the wheels, which took 6 weeks (they alone were shipped via ship, everything else was flown). The wheels are obviously a fairly important part of the entire thing. I got it up and running 2 weeks ago using some wheels off Green (my commuter), but was able to fully build to last night.
So, honestly, not that bad. Having a dedicated workshop space makes life a lot easier...tools to hand, good lighting and space makes life a lot easier, and the practice run on hydraulic setup on Blue, as well as familiarity with L-Twoo gears made a difference. This was my first tubeless setup, which was a little fiddly, but I was following a good guide, and had all the tools around. The final weight was 9.2kg including pedals and cages (which the Grizl at 9.32kg will not include). Final cost was ~£1500 (including import fees), so I feel I've done a good job. Really happy with how it looks, and it also rides really well. It's well designed for bashing over gravel roads. I have a skill limit on single-track and more technical sections, but it's really good fun.
What Next?
Well, I have to rebuild Green (the commuter). It's had various parts cannibalised off it for Blue and Yellow. Now it can have it's wheels back I'll get that back in working order. I am tempted to fit a mid-drive motor to it, and use it as a runabout for when I want to be somewhere, but not be sweaty.
I'd like to review Blue (Winter Bike) ahead of winter, and see if I can get wider tyres on it (currently running 25mm at the front and 28mm at the rear). Mudguards might be a problem, but I have half a thought that if/when I get a 3D printer, I might be able to adapt them to accept wider tyres (the frame will take 35mm tyres, but mudguards tend to reduce that with standard fitment).
For 2025, I might build up a TT bike. I've been doing Time Trials on a road bike this year, but having a full aero-missile is tempting.
Comments
Interesting to see you buy entirely from Chinese direct parts. Quite often in drone land, you have no choice but to go to China direct for bits as they're too specialist for UK stockists to buy.
Having zoomed in on yellow, am I right in saying that the derailleur is electric and the brakes errr ... manual?
Also, having much love for your peg board.
Yep...gears are electric (shifters are wireless, with CR2032 cell batteries, and the rear mech is powered from a battery in the seatpost). Brakes are manually actuated, but use hydraulics rather than a cable...so there are no high tension cables (most of my bikes are this way now, and I cannot begin to describe what an upgrade hydraulics are over cables for brake actuation. Zero friction, zero cable stretch, means you can apply brakes with very little force on the levers)
The Chinese companies are quite interesting in cycling. Nearly all cycling parts are manufactured out there, mostly via a small number of OEM companies...however there is a real stigma over buying them directly (this is partly the reason I have gone for an unbranded frame). In the early 2000's there were a small number of high profile parts failures on some chinese bikes, and general opinion is that QA and customer service is not on a par with the "traditional" brands. It is reasonable to say that structural failures on a bike can easily result in death...ultimately we wear virtually no protection, and regularly hurtle down mountains at 40mph+ (I'm using imperal speeds for the non-cyclists here), with nothing but a thin layer of lycra between us and the flesh-grater that is tarmac.
...however, with a bit of investigation you can find out that some of these chinese brands are originated from more mainstream brands. And a lot of these OEM factories are looking to start selling direct, as the profits are far greater.
Let's take the groupset (gears and brakes), made by L-Twoo in this case. Most serious cyclists would only consider a groupset from the 3 main brands;
Shimano - Japanese company, probably 75% of the market, very well regarded kit
Campagnolo - small market share, but very much "for the purists" as they basically invented modern gear systems. Italian
SRAM - American, been around a while, considered an innovator. Famous for some rather unfortunate advertising
While these are based in Japan, Italy and America, all manufature is done in China. SRAM used to use factories near Hong Kong until 2016, at which point they shifted all work to places near Shanghai, leaving staff and equipment down south. They basically went "fuck it", and started making their own stuff, and called themselves L-Twoo. 8 years later they are looking to move out of the Asian markets, having recently had a massive stall at Eurobike (the biggest trade bike show in the world, in Germany). They have definitely been using early adopters as beta-testers, and online you'll find plenty of stories about failures (water ingress, vibration failures etc). From reading and investigating much of this, I think it is reasonable to say that a significant number of these failures are down to inappropriate usage...after all, those willing to risk early adoption tend to also play a little fast and loose with installation and use. I'd remarkably dull, and have installed the equipment with care, and taken some precautions around water ingress (using liquid electrical tape to seal power cables in mainly). I don't excessively stress my kit...I ride sensibly, avoid potholes whenever possible, and also (critially) maintain my gear. I also selected the manufacturers from online research and reviews (places like Chinertown, and Trace Velo provide reviews and opinions...and increasingly the manufacturers are providing more detail on their equipment, including toleraces and limits).
There are certain things I would not buy from China. Suspension parts, for example, where there are moving structural parts that I cannot check. I'm fine with stuff where movement is via bearings (all of which I can check and, if required, replace...and fortunately bearings account for 99% of all moving parts on bikes). I decided against chinese tyres...as I was going tubeless it's fairly critical that the lay-up of the carcass (especially the front) is good (also there are very few chinese tyre manufacturers). If gears fail I'm walking home (fine). If brakes fail...well, bad things happen, but there are reasons that all bikes (well, all road vehicles actually) are legally required to have 2 mechanically separate braking systems.
The cost saving...well, it's massive. Let's look at groupsets again. The L-Twoo eR9 groupset is a clone of Shimano Di2 105 (I say this as someone who has had hands-on experience of both);
L-Twoo eR9 - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005922459020.html - £350 (ish)
+
Crank & Bottom Bracket (RIRO) - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006481196419.html - £90'ish
Cassette (ZTTO) - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006343081906.html - £37'ish
Shimano Di2 105 - https://www.merlincycles.com/shimano-105-r7170-di2-disc-groupset-12-spee... - £899 on special offer, RRP £1700
So £477 vs £899.
Loved the SRAM video - that made me laugh. Poor fucker. Not what you need.
While your bike costs are eyewatering from the perspective of my monthly budget would take years to save up for, I can totally understand the saving you're getting. For a time it was like that in the hobby drone world, where western companies would do the R&D, build in China and then slap their logo on it. Soon after there would be a Chinese version that the USA builders would reel against.
It's a little different now - people are happier buying direct from China and a lot of the software is open source.
Felix's bike is going to need a proper service (bike kitchen is ok but they just keep you going rather than strip things down and replace) and some paniers before he starts his new school. He's already carrying a big bag on his back and it's going to get worse as he'll have a laptop from next year.
I'd strongly recommend keeping the laptop in a rucksac...there is no better anti-vibration system than the human body, and anything bolted directly to the bike can undergo some fairly heavy shocks, especially over the back wheel (I've lost a pannier before now slowly rolling off a curb...the bounce in the tyre shot it off the mount and into the road...fortunately nothing ran over it). When I was commuting I had clothes/tools/non-delicates in the panniers, but the laptop was in a small rucksac. I've just gotten my super-commuter/runaround back up and running after it had been slowly cannibalised over the past year for various different bikes. The frame is 11 years old now, having been bought back when I originally moved to Woodley, and was no longer commuting down the Kennet towpath. I think pretty much everything else has been replaced since, due to wear-and-tear (mostly dissolving in winter road-salt), or parts being pinched, or inheriting parts from other bikes. It's also had some cheeky holes drilled into the downtube, seatpost and drive-side chainstay to allow gear cabling to be run through internally (something I'd never do on a carbon frame, but this is a chunky aluminium bike, so it can be treated a little rougher)
Hopefully it's good for another decade, though I'm tempted to pop a mid-drive motor on it, and turn it into the ultimate runabout. Realistically it will never go more than 5-6km on a ride...
Thanks for the offer of the service! I'd gladly take you up on that - but yeah, reasons.
I'm interested that you of all people - Pete The Machine - would put a motor on a bike. Under what circumstances would you not be self-propelling?
I must admit I like the idea of mountain-biking with an electric. I know others (that are a little fitter than I but not by much) that have hire-and-ride in Wales and it was great going both up hill and down!
The use case for an eBike for me is if I want to go somewhere in civvies, and not be sweaty at the end of it (for example, a trip across town, which here involves a 10% climb almost out of the door). The commuter is really the only one of my bikes I would leave locked up somewhere for any length of time (even here, where bike stops are pretty chilled, and we've often left bikes stacked outside a bar in the evening...we are sitting next to them all, not that we could run after anyone!). I've done a couple of event volunteering things on the edge of town, and I want to get there in normal shoes and clothes, not cleats (I absolutely hate riding a bike without clipping in for any distance now, feels genuinely weird, and I keep lifting my feet off the pedals). One of my stated goals of moving here was to remove any dependence on a car, so having an eShopper loaded up with food is fine by me.
I know a fair number of people who love eMTB's...as you say, it's free uplift. A fair number of the trails in the Dales are good for that sort of thing. Up in Swaledale there is a place that specialises in them, as there are a lot of fire trails and bridleways for tearing about on. I think I'd find an eBike too short ranged for anything above short trips (or, as one chap found out on a club ride, simply dead weight, as the pace was such that the motor never kicked in)
I do love the idea of a cargo bike with some e-assist for the hills. There's been a few times where I've had to take the car for bulky stuff (hay for the guinea pigs are an excellent example). They're just outside my price range right now.
Cargo bikes are very expensive, partly as they are all either custom-made/boutique or brought in from the continent. I've considered one, but I think I'd be better off with a general purpose eBike and a trailer. If you want a really cool trailer, I could see a system where the trailer has brakes linked to the bike (to stop a loss of control on descents, again thinking about the 10% climb by my house).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iw7zM4NNEN8
I quite like the aesthetics of single-wheel trailers with a stay-hitch (ExtraWheel or BOB Yak), but I suspect a double-wheel with a high-hitch is overall more practical...though I do subscribe to the theroy of cool with bike stuff.
I had a look at trailers when Felix and I were tempted to do some touring (he's no longer bothered). From what I could tell, the dual wheel ones were better if you were mostly on roads/wide paths, whereas the single wheel were for touring on rougher areas.
Loved the wireless breaks - not sure I'd trust them tho!